Friday, March 7, 2008

Blah Blah Blahg - this one is for Keith...


Ok, so 3 weeks after my warranty runs out on my phone it breaks. So i have to sign a new 2 year contract with the phone company, purchase a new phone, purchase extras for that phone in order to get the rebate, then send in the rebate in order to save $100.00 or so. Granted, I like the phone and the internet on it and all that stuff so it isn't so bad, but still....So here is my problem with the whole thing....People think attorneys rip you off, but if you look at the market, i think you are getting a pretty sweet deal.


Case in point is this: First: I just had to drop $350.00 on a new phone, up my wireless coverage, etc. all for about 20 minutes worth of work. That equates to $950.00 per hour of work, not including the monthly total that AT&T will receive.


Second: Plumbers, mechanics, etc. They charge a "labor rate" of around $80 to $100 per hour. Doesn't come close to attorneys rates? Probably not, but if you look at the time they put into school (none) and the time they actually work on your project, maybe an hour or so, add in the cost of the new stove, water heater, etc...and you are looking at 300 to 400 per hour...Plus, if you go to a mechanic i will guarantee that something else will go wrong with your car in about a month and you will be right back in front of them.


Attorneys here in vegas charge anywhere from 200 to 300 per hour, depending on how long the attorney has been in practice. People think this is a rip off. It isn't. If you are a corporation and you don't have an attorney, you will get raked over the coals. People think they are smart when they go to a paralegal service or some type of outfit that creates an LLC for them for $199 or so. This makes great sense at first, until you get sued, or your company is no longer recognized by the state becuase you didn't file the correct documents, so you are now personally liable. And how about tax advice. Does that service explain to you the advantages of different tax plans? Then you learn that you probably should have had an operating agreement, shouldn't have commingled your funds, should have filed an annual list of members and managers, etc. And only if you would have gone to an attorney to start. They may have charged you $1500 for the whole package, but it will be worth your time in the end. Trust me, (Keith, look it up).


Family law is another area where people think they can go cheep. Family law is also the toughest area for me to collect my bills. People think family law should be free for some reason. A lot of people will agree on their divorce, how they are splitting things up, time with the kids, etc. "I just want to be nice." DON'T!!!!!!!!! I recently had a daughter of a lady that works here come in to my office to review the agreement that a paralegal service had done for them. By the time i was finished, the thing was all marked up and sent back to the paralegal service to redo. If she would just have me do it in the first place, it might cost her a little more, but in three years she won't have to wonder why provisions regarding holiday visitation, child support specifics, separate debt, who gets what car, and the like weren't included in her divorce decree. Family law sucks, especially when you have kids involved. But you better not be nice when you get divorced, cause it will cost you THOUSANDS later on if you are nice. Trust me, I do this for a living, look it up....


Another area deals with estate planning. You will see a lot of lawyers advertise around town to do a will for you for $99. Sound GREAT! Except for this little tidbit: the minute you die, that will has to be probated. What does probate cost? If an attorney handles the probate, usually AT LEAST %5 of the value of the estate. Yep, so if you have an estate worth $1,000,000.00, you might as well chop $50,000.00 out for your attorney. Thus, just get a Trust. It might cost you anywhere from $1,500 to $3,000 now, depending on the size of your estate, but you will avoid probate and the heartache your kids will have to go through doing probate, especially if they fight over your estate. Don't think it will happen to you? Trust me, it will. That is what keeps the 40 attorneys at my office in business. It's true. Look it up...


My point? You get what you pay for. So maybe plumbers and mechanics aren't so bad, especially if you don't know what you are doing, cause you probably won't do it right the first time.

16 comments:

Heidi said...

In other words, if you're getting a divorce, call Stephen and he will handle it for you. If you want to plan out your estate, call Andrew and he will handle it for you. Neither one of them will rip you off!
And I totally agree with your comment that you shouldn't be nice in divorces - my sister and her second husband are both paying the price for that!

Christina said...

It's true about just paying for the plumber. It is well worth the money for us because Steve knows nothing about plumbing, electrical, mechanics, etc. There's a reason he's an attorney. To pay for the plumber!

Heidi said...

200-300/hour is on the low side. Unless they are insurance defense, 200 is the MINIMUM attorneys charge. The partners at my previous firm were 375-425/hour.

Keith A. Runyon said...

Yawn.....

What do you mean I can't "comingle" funds? Everyone gets paid...no big deal.

You guys are actually pretty cheap - us insurance guys charge way more per hour AND we get to golf 50% of the time - plus, we're a lot better golfers. It's true, look it up.

Dixon Leavitt said...

425 isnt bad...I worked at a firm where the partners charged 500-700 per hour. 500 was with the "discount"

steve said...

i know which two firms you guys worked at. both are overrated for the attorneys you are paying for...

Angela and Mike said...

Congrats on the new baby on the way! That is exciting. I will make sure to pay the money for good service since you get what you pay for :) Hopefully I don't ever need your help with a divorce.

Heidi said...

There aint an attorney at Hutchison and Steffen billing at 500/hour. I know that for a fact. Steve--you have no room to talk about overrated firms. No offense, but I've been to ATMS and it's the only firm I know of with a revolving door in the front.

steve said...

hello? mr. pot? mr. pot black? this is kettle calling...

Keith A. Runyon said...

Lawyer Wars.... I love it!!!! What clients are you billing while you argue with each other?

IDEA: Why don't you start up your own firm...together....I will volunteer my leadership to the cause.

Argue that.

Heidi said...

I'm not arguing with him. There's nothing to argue! Steve has a good gig there, but it's no secret that ATMS has a reputation for churning and burning associates. It's true. Look it up.

Now Steve won't talk to me for weeks! I shouldn't have responded to his overrated comment, although I know he's joking.

BTW, I hear that Steve is better than Wade at golf. Is that true?

Note to self--Bill .2 to Keith.

steve said...

.2? that's it. at least make it
.4 for having to review and evaluate the other comments!

Heidi said...

if i was an insurance defense lawyer, i would. cuz the insurance companies pay crap and you got to make it up somehow, right? j/k

Kelsey said...

I am so confused. All I read is blah blah blah, make $500 an hour, blha blah blah! Excited for you to come! Jared has already planned out YOUR MEALS~! Now that's love...

Kelsey said...

What kind of cereal must you have for your midnight feedings? What other stuff do you like to eat? I don't want to disappoint you! =)

The Hunters said...

This post makes me realize that my husband and I are probably screwed. I, with no legal training, finagled all of the docs to make our small business a corporation. Hopefully, no one tries to sue us.

Christina, congrats on the pregnancy!